From The Comments SPECIAL EDITION: Salmon, Steelhead, Energy, Economics and Transportation
In May, Idaho Wildlife Federation shared a series of videos and infographics featuring fishing legend Buzz Ramsey appearance on Outdoor GPS discussing the need to breach the lower Snake River dams.
WATCH BUZZ RAMSEY ON GPS OUTDOORS DISCUSSING SALMON, STEELHEAD AND THE LOWER SNAKE RIVER DAMS
Our posts, and Remsey’s videos, created a healthy buzz (pun obviously intended) of conversation and inspired thoughtful questions. We’ve compiled what we felt were the most valuable comments -and our responses- because at IWF we are committed to supporting, enabling, educating and engaging our supporters.
Nine times out of ten a hot cup of coffee or a cold beer is a superior way to sort through respectful disagreements or brainstorm potential solutions than across the world wide web.
But, Idaho’s a big, wild place and face-to-face interactions can be tough sometimes.
Great conversations, connections and educational moments can and do occur in that deep, dark hole otherwise known as the comments section.
Here’s a special edition of , ‘From The Comments” focusing on salmon, steelhead, fishing energy replacement, transportation and economics.
Comment: Just think how fat the lower Columbia pinniped population must be getting with the large return of springers.
Idaho Wildlife Federation Response: We’ve already begun lethally culling seals and sea lions, however, of the 21 million salmon and steelhead smolt that leave Idaho, only as much as 100,000 Idaho fish (around 0.04% mortality), while the dams cause about 11.5 million smolt deaths (up to 60% mortality). While we believe pinnipeds should be managed seriously, it is nothing if we don’t deal with the biggest mortality influences.
Comment: Go to Alaska if you want more salmon, we need the dams for shipping wheat and other products, not to mention the cost of taking them out.
Idaho Wildlife Federation Response: Since 2000, shipping through the dams has decreased 80%, with shippers abandoning the river to ship wheat. Towns like Rosalia, Washington built their own rail terminal to get their wheat to the Tri-Cities. The free market is speaking, and river shipping is now propped up by government subsidies, which does not cry out as vital infrastructure. The cost of taking the dams out, according to the Army Corps of Engineers, will be about $1.5b, which includes a 50% cushion. Compare that to the $1b it costs a year now, to maintain the dams and mitigate the loss of fish they cause, and the finances do not pan out to keep the dams in place.
Comment 3: It appears to be the strongest spring chinook salmon run (in a while) this spring. How did that happen? Must not be the dams fault after all.
Idaho Wildlife Federation Response: This chinook run is only near the 10-year average, which is only 25% of the agreed upon goal of 217,000 fish over granite dam. So, this is in no way a record, and not even one third of the best run since the dams were built.
Comment: Why don't they stop fishing (for) them if they are endangered? Close all seasons for 10 years before thinking about breaching the dams.
Idaho Wildlife Federation Response: The endangered fish are the wild fish, which are illegal to harvest. Hatchery fish are specifically produced to mitigate the loss of wild fish harvest.
Comment: Question- are the Salmon / Steelhead runs as strong as ever in those Oregon and Washington rivers that have no dams???
Idaho Wildlife Federation Response: Every OR and WA river is experiencing a smolt-to-adult return ratio (SAR) much higher than the required threshold of 2%. Above 2% means that even when runs are depressed (fish runs are cyclical), two adults are replacing themselves with two offspring making it back to spawn. Rivers like the John Day, Yakima, Deschutes, and others all have SARs well above the needed 2%, while only Idaho's fish are below 2%, often even below 1%- a path to extinction.
Comment: How do Sea Lions and Seals affect the runs? If so?, which rivers?
Idaho Wildlife Federation Response: We’ve already begun lethally culling seals and sea lions, however, of the 21 million salmon and steelhead smolt that leave Idaho, only as much as 100,000 Idaho fish (around 0.04% mortality), while the dams cause about 11.5 million smoly deaths (60% mortality). While we believe pinnipeds should be managed seriously, it is nothing if we don’t deal with the biggest mortality influence.
Comment: Breaching the dams would be the most counterproductive method I can think of. Ignoring the DEVASTATING LOSS OF CLEAN HYDRO POWER, the sea lions and other predators would still remain in place, and agriculture would never recover. As it stands, we are managing pretty good runs of salmon and steelhead, without the drastic loss of power, and who knows what has not been considered that may occur!
Idaho Wildlife Federation Response: The lower Snake River dams produce surplus power, often at a loss. It is not a drastic loss of power. Regardless, we can replace those dams - which are only 3.9% of BPA’s total power generation portfolio - with other hydro projects, modular nuclear, battery storage and other mechanisms.
Re: sea lions- We’ve already begun lethally culling seals and sea lions, however, of the 21 million salmon and steelhead smolt that leave Idaho, only as much as 100,000 Idaho fish (around 0.04% mortality), while the dams cause about 11.5 million smoly deaths (60% mortality). While we believe pinnipeds should be managed seriously, it is nothing if we don’t deal with the biggest mortality influence.
Ag will be just fine if transportation was adequately replaced, which is already happening. Shipping through the dams has declined 80% since its peak in 2000, never to return. Towns like Rosalia, WA built their own grain terminal and rail co-op, connecting to the line to the Tri-cities. The free market is speaking and abandoning the river already. So, it is not going to devastated Ag, especially if we help build the infrastructure.
Re: runs- the runs are not good, and not even close to good. We are nearing the 10-year average, which has declined substantially over the last decade. We wont reach a third of the way to our established goal of 217,000 fish to Idaho.
Comment: I say we breach the first four dams first and then we'll take a look at the four on the snake river. The math is the same we get rid of four dams so the fish only have to fight for dams
Idaho Wildlife Federation Response: The dams on the Columbia River produce over 70% of BPA’s power generation, while the four Snake dams produce only 3.9%. Those Columbia dams are economically viable, while the Snake dams produce surplus power, sold at a loss often throughout the year.
Link to All Comments: https://www.facebook.com/253124008097628/posts/5093819430694704
Comment: What effect does the unregulated fishing in international waters by foreign countries?
Idaho Wildlife Federation Response: It is difficult to predict the impact of an unknown data sets like illegal fishing in foreign waters. But we do know roughly where certain runs of fish are heading in the ocean. For instance, spring/summer chinook never head more than 200 miles into the ocean into international waters, so we know harvest by other countries has little to no impact on that species. Snake river fall chinook however, an extirpated species brought back and therefore exempt from the ESA, swim in a different direction than their spring/summer cousins, and are subject to foreign harvest, but ironically are not impacted negatively from this.
That said, using data we do have here in the U.S., since listing during the 1990s under the Endangered Species Act the federal government has tightly controlled harvest. Today, dams play a far greater role killing salmon than fishermen. The dams, for example, kill between 40 and 92 percent of the migrating Snake River salmon and steelhead. Fishing takes between 0 to 10 percent of any given run. Snake River fall Chinook is the one exception. It is caught in the ocean and the lower Columbia River where it mixes with other abundant populations found on the lower Columbia River. Due to these minimal overall impacts, scientists have determined that totally eliminating fishing for the renowned Snake River spring/summer chinook and steelhead in particular would provide very little to no benefits and fail to recover these endangered populations. And it would devastate fishing communities from California to Alaska and into Idaho. Lower Snake River dam removal is the surest way to recover all of these salmon and steelhead species so all anglers can again have an opportunity to fish. - Largely compiled from WildSalmon.Org
Comment: Your 1000 megawatts is on the low end of yearly production. With a 25% capacity factor, a 2-MW turbine would produce. 2 MW × 365 days × 24 hours × 25% = 4,380 MWh = 4,380,000. So less than 1/2 a megawatt per wind turbine.
Idaho Wildlife Federation Response: That is incorrect. The production of the LSRDs is measured and sold. The average output for the last 15 years is 963 MGW. [BPA’s own numbers]
Comment: Fraser river has no dams. Salmon runs are the same there as dammed rivers. It's not the dams.
Idaho Wildlife Federation Response: Great question for inquisitive folks looking for real answers. Not all rivers face the same conditions. Let’s take the Fraser River in BC, Canada. First thing to note is that yes, its runs are also depressed, BUT, and glaringly important- they are not below 2% SAR. So even though depressed, if that is maintained they will sustain through bad years. Second: the mainstem Fraser may not be dammed, but spring/summer chinook do not spawn in the main stem of any river they return to. Many of the main tributaries of the Fraser are dammed (Seton River, Terzaghi, Thompson, Nicola, etc.), not to mention the many diversion dams. Some of the largest open pit copper mines in the world have also consumed many natal streams up there (you can actually see these mines from space- massive). Lastly, the average temp increase of the Fraser has doubled those of rivers in the lower 48. Those runs of fish were accustomed to much colder water when their temp increases have doubled ours it’s a big deal. This is all to say the Fraser is facing its own problems and some are rather similar to the Columbia Basin in regards to dams and such. But yet, their SARs are still above 2%.
Comment: I would like to see scientific proof that just these four dams are to sole cause of poor runs. These dams have all been live since the 70s. For years after the runs were good. The issue is elsewhere.
Idaho Wildlife Federation Response: Bonneville Power Administration, who operates the dams, recognizes it themselves. https://idahowildlife.org/.../bpa-funded-study-states...
Comment: Each run from each river goes back to a general area in the ocean to rear itself year after year, just like they return to the same river. It has been known for decades that the amount of food in the ocean in that run area, determines the size of the return. IT"S IN THE OCEAN!!!!
Idaho Wildlife Federation Response: The ocean has always been the major influence of fish cycles. Fish have evolved with this fluctuation for millions of years. However, fish runs on tributaries lower in the Columbia River still enjoy smolt-to-adult return ratios over 2%, the threshold for population sustenance. The Deschutes, Yakima, and John Day Rivers all have over the required 2% replacement rate, while only Idaho’s fish are under 2%, a path towards extinction. Yet Idaho’s fish share the same ocean, go through the same gauntlet of nets, sea lions and other predators.
Comment: 70% behind those dams. OK. How about no fish ladders from Hells Canyon dam all the way to southern Idaho? No fish ladders for Dworshak dam? Gill nets in Columbia? But the silver bullet to save the fish is the four lower Snake River dams......sure. Ignorance on display.
Idaho Wildlife Federation Response: There are many things killing many stocks of our fish across the Columbia Basin. There is no silver bullet, but there is nothing we can implement that will have any significant impact on our fish that does not also involve breach of the LSRDs.
The Snake provides access to the Salmon River, where over 60%% of all wild columbia river chinook and steelhead spawning habitat is still intact. Those spawning grounds are protected by the Frank Church Wilderness, and are projected to be the last cold water refugia in a few decades with warming and precipitation regimes staying on the course they are headed. If we can’t get fish back to the last best habitat, then they are doomed.
As to the other blocked areas. We would love to see them back to those grounds. But if we can’t even get fish back to the undammed rivers like the Salmon, it is all for nothing.
Comment: Breaching the dams before removing the gill nets for lets say three years is idiotic. How many of the fish are slaughtered indiscriminately by these nets? Use a little logic for a while and really make an effort to help the fish before using the "silver bullet" of dam breaching. If breaching dams is the only way to save the fish why not all of them including Grand Coulee? I've said my opinion and know you will disagree, so be it.
Idaho Wildlife Federation Response: Netting impacts the runs of every tributary on the Columbia. The runs from the Deschutes, Yakima, and John Day all enjoy sustainable smolt-to-adult return ratios, high above the 2% threshold required to maintain runs. Yet, only Snake river stocks are heading toward extinction. They go through the same nets, seals, ocean, and recreational fishing the other tributaries go through, but are the only ones winking out. We know the dams cause about 60% fish mortality. If we reduce mortality elsewhere, it will still mean nothing if the dams are also not breached. Like you said, there is no silver bullet- it is an all of the above strategy, but that also includes breach.
We can replace the services the dams provide easily enough.
Comment: You stated "We can replace the services the dams provide easily enough." How? When? At what cost? Your canned responses are not solutions. The infrastructure required to replace the dams needs to be in place before breaching, agree or not?
Idaho Wildlife Federation Response: Of course we agree all services the dams provide need to be replaced beforehand. It’s disingenuous to argue that dam breach means we simply remove dams and leave people to figure it all out afterwards.
The dams were designed to be breached. Only the earthen portion is removed while the concrete remains. The Army Corps estimates it will take two years to breach the dams, timed to do minimal damage to fish runs. And it will cost about $1.5b, which includes a 50% cushion for unforeseen circumstances (as all Corps projects require).
Such questions are already answered, and many can be found in congressman Simpson’s Columbia Basin Initiative, which was informed by over 350 meetings with ag interests, energy experts, and so on.
Comment: How about Dworshak? How about terns, seals, cormorants and pelicans that were never in LC Valley, ocean temps, river temps, gill nets, over fished areas like the mouth of the Grande Rhonde, predatory fish, cattle raising on water ways where the cattle have river access, any others we can think of? Many tentacled beast trying to be killed by the most publicly visible single solution. Seems if these aren’t all willing to be addressed not much with change. Dams were present in 2009. One of the biggest runs ever.
Idaho Wildlife Federation Response: It is true that salmon and steelhead face a myriad of challenges returning to their natal streams. However, the scale to which any of the aforementioned factors (predators, tribal and recreational harvest, damaged habitat due to cattle) pales in comparison to salmon and steelhead that die due to effects of the water temperature, increased predator pressures and increased time it takes to return to the ocean. For example, think about it this way: Tributaries lower in the Columbia River still enjoy smolt-to-adult return ratios over 2%, the threshold for population sustenance. The Deschutes, Yakima, and John Day Rivers all reach over the required 2% replacement rate, while only Idaho’s fish are under 2%, a path towards extinction. Yet Idaho’s fish share the same ocean, go through the same gauntlet of nets, sea lions and other predators. The only obstacles they face that all other fish don’t, are the LSRDs. Study after study, including the latest 2020 BiOp from the Columbia-Snake River Operating agencies conclude that breach is the single best thing we can do to immediately improve fish runs.
Comment: In every other country in the world hydro power is considered a renewable resource. Where are you going to get the energy to recharge all your electric cars. Who's going to build all the infastructure to support all the extra trucks. At diesel approaching 6.00 a gallon. When your food costs double and your electricity doubles. My brother was fishing below Little Goose and caught several walleye over 4 pounds.
What about the decreased runs on the Fraser river no dams.
Idaho Wildlife Federation Response: Not all rivers face the same conditions. Let’s take the Fraser River in BC, Canada. First thing to note is that yes, its runs are also depressed, BUT, and glaringly important- they are not below 2% SAR. So even though depressed, if that is maintained they will sustain through bad years. Second: the mainstem Fraser may not be dammed, but spring/summer chinook do not spawn in the main stem of any river they return to. Many of the main tributaries of the Fraser are dammed (Seton River, Terzaghi, Thompson, Nicola, etc.), not to mention the thousands of diversion dams. Some of the largest open pit copper mines in the world have also consumed many natal streams up there (you can actually see these mines from space- massive). Lastly, the average temp increase of the Fraser has doubled those of rivers in the lower 48. Those runs of fish were accustomed to much colder water when their temp increases have doubled ours it’s a big deal. This is all to say the Fraser is facing its own problems and some are rather similar to the Columbia Basin in regards to dams and such. But yet, their SARs are still above 2%.
If we replace the services provided by the dams, transportation and power, there will be no impact to your food costs or electricity. Moreover, no food that comes to Idahoans is shipped up the Snake River. Grain is the main commodity shipped out of Idaho through the dams, and most of that goes to international markets. Regardless, since 2000, shipping through the dams had decreased by 80%, never to return. The free market is abandoning the river. Towns like Rosalia, WA, built their own grain terminal and connected a rail line to the main rail route. They will never return to the river and enjoy a far cheaper transportation option, which actually brings prices DOWN.
Comment: Barging them around the dams would be a better idea . What are we going to do for electric power ? People were without power last summer with the dams . And they want to go to electric cars. INSANE
Idaho Wildlife Federation Response: Barging is expensive and yet another facet of the current system taxpayers and ratepayers will have to shoulder for a system that already produces less than a quarter for every dollar invested. Studies have shown barging can increase straying of fish, and we’ve yet to prove barging has any net positive benefits of fish survival.
Power: the dams only produce less than 1000 megawatts per year, often selling power for a loss due to the significant onlining of other power generating sources across the west. Existing proposals to build power generation facilities are already being undertaken that replace the power produced by the Snake River dams 10 times over. Further, BPA currently produces surplus power, more than can be consumed in the PNW. Of BPA’s total power generation portfolio, the LSRDs only produce 3.9%, and all of that is surplus. The last remaining benefit of the dams is their supply of baseload power, which can easily be replaced by a multitude of sources including other hydro projects, modular nuclear (which could be plugged into the existing Hanford site), a mix of solar and wind with battery storage. The best part is: this isn’t fantasy. As we mentioned, shovel ready projects are being undertaken that by far outproduce the power generated by the dams.
Regarding Barging: The challenge is that attempts to improve returns of hatchery steelhead in Idaho are resulting in potentially strong negative impacts in downstream populations. Tattum et al. (2020) suggest actions that can be taken to reduce the straying, such as altering the time at which the smolts are barged and limiting the overall number of smolts.
But whatever action(s) may be taken to reduce straying, it is time to rethink the practice of barging hatchery steelhead smolts if it will continue to put other ESA-listed populations at risk.
Hatchery salmon and steelhead remain popular with anglers. We support hatchery fish as long as there is not a viable, harvestable wild population, that, and our Portfolio Approach encompasses hatchery supplementation in rivers where wild populations are compromised and unlikely to recover. However, protecting and restoring runs of wild salmon and steelhead and their habitats remains, by far, the cheapest and most effective way to ensure our steelhead fishing heritage will be sustained.
We need to make sure our preferences as anglers align with the real needs of salmon and steelhead. Barging smolts past eight dams in the Snake/Columbia system is not helping bring back wild salmon and steelhead populations, and in fact is hurting wild populations in major tributary-strongholds such as the John Day River. If we really want to stop the decline of salmon and steelhead in one of the greatest and, historically, one of the most productive river systems on earth, there’s really only one scientifically-supported way to do it: take out the four Lower Snake dams. - compiled from Wild Steelheaders United
Link to All Comments: https://www.facebook.com/253124008097628/posts/5093808137362500
Comment: (Why can’t we) stop or control hill net fishing
Idaho Wildlife Federation Response: Gill net fishing is already highly regulated, but as the home for the majority of Columbia Basin fish, we agree Idaho should get a more equitable share of harvest. Regardless, think of it this way- all Columbia basin stocks of fish go through the same gill nets, ocean conditions, and gauntlet of seals, birds, fish predators, and harvest. Yet, only Snake river stocks are on an extinction trajectory, while runs below the lower Snake River dams, like the Yakima, Deschutes, John Day, all enjoy a sustainable threshold of smolt-to-adult returns.
Comment: If Oregon would manage the sea lion population at the mouth the Columbia we’d have more salmon running up to Columbia and all the other tributary‘s come on guys pull your head out of your butt
Idaho Wildlife Federation Response: It is important to remember that of the 21 million steelhead and salmon smolts that leave Idaho, over 60% will be killed by the dams: that is over 11 million. Sea lions are responsible for anywhere between 10,000 to 100,000 fish, less than a half percent of total mortality. While we agree predator management is necessary (IWF advocated for the amendment to the Marine Mammals Protection Act successfully, which allowed for lethal culling), it’s only a drop in the bucket comparable to putting a bandaid on a scratch while avoiding the hemorrhaging wound elsewhere.
Think of it this way: every Columbia tributary fish run faces the same ocean conditions, seals, sea lions, nets, anglers, and other predators, yet only Idaho’s fish are under the required 2% smolt-to-adult return ratio required for population sustenance. The Yakima, Deschutes, and John Day river stocks are all above the required threshold. Why would only Idaho’s stocks be headed towards extinction? The answer is, and proven in study after study, the LSRDs.
Comment: The only way for the dams to be removed is for Nuclear power. Start promoting Nuclear power as a replacement first
Idaho Wildlife Federation Response: We do support an all-of-the-above approach. Energy experts agree that the dams are already easily replaceable with a multitude of projects, which includes modular nuclear reactors, which can be plugged into the existing Hanford site.
Link To All Comments: https://www.facebook.com/253124008097628/posts/5093774597365854